The Cambrian

MR. DILLWYN AND HIS CONSTITUENTS. PUBLIC MEETING AT SWANSEA. On Monday evening a meeting of Swansea electors was coavened by the Mayor, at the Townhall, for the purpose of affording Mr. L. Ll Dillwyn, M.P., an opportunity of addressing his constituents on the political questions of the day. The Mayor occupied the chair, and the atten- dance was very good. The Mayor, in opening the proceedings, said Fellow- townsmen,—I have been asked to convene this meeting and to preside here to-night, and I candidly confess that no duty that has been mine, since I have been appointed your representative in our local Parliament, has been more in consonance with my feelings than that which falls to my lot to-night. The meeting has been convened that you may jhear your representative in the Imperial Parlia- ment give an account of his stewardship. It is not un- usual for other members of Parliament—whether from the hesitancy an.i reticence of party, or a more prudent re- serve-to show great unwillingness to meet their consti- tuents, to be disinclined to give them opportunities of judging of their conduct, and to seek for further support. Now such cenduct, I need scarcely tell you, is not prac- tically the hon member's for Swansea—(cheers)—he has always been ready to meet his constituents, to give them an opportunity of judging of his conduct, and of expres- sing their feelings. In a large meeting like this, I think, no doubt there are many shades of political opinion rep- resented, but whether we agree with Mr. Dillwyn or not, I think we shall be bound to admit this—that he occupies not merely a creditable but a prominent place in the House of Commons. (Hear.) Although he is what is called an "advauced politician," his opinions have always carried weight with them, whatever Government may have been in office. He has not been prominent as a party leader, but on more than one occasion, in fact on many occasions, he has undertaken measures of really national importance. It ha.s not been his to take a position as a leader of a party, but I feel sure of this, gentlemen, that while we may wonder sometimes at the facility with which the House of Commons seems to accomplish their work by every means, and not only by the aid of the more distinguished members. I feel sure of this—there are few members in the House of Commons who would be more missed than your member Mr. Dillwyn. (Cheers.) Gentlemen, Mr. Dillwyn has made himself distinguished to my mind in respect to his political views, but I will avoid expressing my opinion on the point. You will ex- cuse me and understand the motives for so doing. I shall express no opinion as to whether Mr. Dillwyn was right or wrong in all his actions in forwarding or retarding the measures which came before him; I say let him have the liberty to express these opinions but I am quite sure I shall carry with me the concurring voice of the whole borough when I say that a more conicientious, a more devoted, a more painstaking, and I will add, a more ac- cessible member it would be impossible for any consti- tuency to have. He carries with him a large experience as well as a broad intelligence for the discharge of his duties. I feel sure that we all esteem him highly in re- gard to the conduct which he has developed since he has represented us in Parliament. I feel that must be our feeling whatever may be our particnlar views. And when he has been now and then in the shades of opposition, I don't,think any injurious effect ha" been caused either to hi(temper or his political role. If I may be allowed to express an opinion on that point, I think a measure of op- position- honest, not factious opposition-is rather suited tothe genius and idiosyncracies of our member, for which- ever party may be in power he feels himself under a sense of duty to keep on his way. Well, gentlemen, I don't think our House of Commons would be more useful and honest if it were to get rid of its independent critics of the type of Mr. Dillwyn. (Cheers.) There are many men in the House of Commons who are mere ciphers there, but I think the House of Commaas has long felt the manly tone of Mr. Dillwyn, for it was never given to the hon. member for Swansea to be a cipher in the House. (Cheers.) Whenever he speaks, and on whichever side he speaks, he is sure to say something worth hearing, something that will win attention and I have not the slightest doubt that the hon. gentleman will, in the manner which char- acterizes him, give us something worth hearing to-night. If I may be permitted, before calling upon the hon. mem- ber, I should like to allude to a little circumstance, which in my opinion, illustrates the conduct of the hon. gentle- man. He is remarkable for his assiduity in Parliamentary duties, and he is ever alive to the local interests of his constituency in which he resides. In my opinion the corporation have acted wisely in considering an impor- tant scheme of town improvement, by which we hope to sweep away the most abominable and most disreputable places in Swansea, and replace them by decent healthy streets and dwellings. (Loud cheers ) It cannot be un- known to you, gentlemen, that the conduct of the land- owners, whose property will be interfered with in these districts, will very materially affect the carrying out the scheme. Therefore it was with great gratffieation I re- ceived soon after the scheme was made public, a letter from one of the most important of these landowners, in which sympathy was expressed with the movement, and in which cordial co-operation and assistance was readily preferred. Need I say that that letter was from the hon. member for Swansea. (Loud cheers.) I hope the other landowners, whose property is affected, will fol- low his example, and in that case I venture to state that the difficulties in the prosecution of the scheme will be diminished by one half. Had Mr. Dillwyn's views been exactly the reverse of what they are, I should have felt it my duty to make this public testimony to the readi- ness with which he has entered into the schemes which are promoted by the local authorities with the desire of im- proving the constituency which he represents. Gentlemen, I will now call upon the hon. member to address you. (Cheers.) Mr. Dillwyn, who on rising was warmly greeted, said he ought to explain to the meeting why he had asked them, through the Mayor, to meet him earlier than it had been his custom to deliver his annual address. The reason was, that he was desirious to address his constituents in other parts of the borough in the course of this winter, conse- quently it was necessary to begin a little earlier than usual. (Hear, hear.) He had never, he confessed, ad- dressed his constituents under greater difficulties, because he had nothing very satisfactory to tell them. (A laugh.) He did not think the last Session of Parliament was such as they had a right to expect the Conservatives would have given them and here let him say that he was bound to speak the truth that was in him. If he said anything that was offensive to those who were politically opposed to him, he hoped they would excuse him, for ho should not do so in an offensive manner. (Hear, hear.) His in- tention was to speak of the present Government, and its future prospects. Last year they were told, and with very great reason, that they were not to expect very much, as the Conservatives, after a very long absence from office, having suddenly and unexpectedly been called into power, of course required time to prepare and com- plete their measures and it would not have been fair to press them, or to expect too much from them in their first Session. (Hear, hear.) The Conservatives were not met with any factious opposition, and certainly the people did not get much out of them. (Hear, hear, and laughter). They had a right to ask for a little breathing time, before they developed their policy. The Conservatives did not tell them that they were going to introduce any what they called "sensational policy," but which he called vigorous—but the Liberal party did, and they had a right to expect that they would perform what they had promised—to give them, namely sound progressive legis- lation not sensational measures, but such social reforms as required to be dealt with, and showing them what Conservative progress really meant. They (the Liberals) were taught to understand that there was to be but little difference between the Conservatives and the Liberals, but that the Conservatives would not bring for- ward any flaming legislation. Now, however, they had had a second Session of Parliament, and the Conservatives had had plenty of time to mature their reforms, and time also to carry them, for they had an overwhelming majority. Never since he had been in Parliament had he seen so well drilled a party, or one that voted so steadily in obedience to the whip. Well, they brought forward a great number of measures some of them of very good promises, and useful if carried in their entirety. In the beginning of the Session, they had a great programme laid before them, and if those measures had been carried out, they would have had a good account to give of the past Session. The Liberals met the Government with every encouragement in all their progressive measures but somehow or other, as the Session went on, a blight seemed to come over them. There were one or two good measures carried, and he spoke it with all honour, and gave them full credit for them. (Hear, hear.) He would mention, as one of these, the Labour Bill, which, he thought, was a great step in advance. [Some opposition was here raised by an individual and many demanded that he should be turned out.] The Mayor promised the interrupter an opportunity of speaking in due time, provided he remained quiet during the address. Mr. Dillwyn continued It was a fair and useful mea- sure fair to the masters and fair to the workmen. It provided that breaches of contract should not be punished by imprisonment, but by damages. (Hear, hear.) That was the main character of the Bill, except in special cases where the public were injured or serious mischief was done, and in those exceptional cases there was power given to Justices and County Court judges to enforce imprison- ment, but in ordinary contracts imprisonment was done a.way with. It was a good Bill, and he was glad that it was so; but he was sorry to say that most of the other measures were a set-off against that good measure. There was another fairly good measure which would be very good if they got men of spirit to carry it out. He referred to the Artisans' Dwellings Bill. He thought, however, that the Bill was too permissive. It was a Bill of great consequence, and being a tentative measure he was glad to see that it was to some extent permissive. That par- ticular Bill empowered Corporations of towns of 25,000 inhabitants and upwards to clear away "rookeries" of vice and disease, and to improve the thoroughfares of the towns where they were situated. It was a permissive, not a compulsory Bill. On the whole, it was a good measure, and he congratulated Swansea on having a gentleman of such public spirit as their present Mayor— (cheers)—to take advantage of the Act, which would conduce greatly to the moral and sanitary condition of the town. Those two measures were about all he liked in the legislation of the past Session. There were a great many other measures which were passed in a mutilated form. They went on well for a time but for some un- known cause, which he could not tell, it was not their (the Liberals) amendments that influenced them, but some unknown cause operated with the Government, and the stringent clauses of the measures were withdrawn. The Bills were mutilated, and instead of coming out as stringent measures they had permissive legislation. That was the character of many of the Bills passed in this late Session of Parliament. The Agricultural Holdings Bill was one of those measures that promised a good deal to the tenant. If it had been carried in its entirety, it would have given real benefit to the tenant, and would have been in the interest of the landlord and tenant, and have tended to the improvement of the land; but .aBtead of being carried in its original form, it was curtailed, and went the way of all the other measures, and came out as a worthless ta [The noisy individual in the gallery again interrupted, and there were cries of "Order," and "Turn him out."] Mayor: Order, gentlemen. (To the individual): If you continue to interrupt, you must be turned out. Voice: It is a public meeting, Mr. Mayor. Mayor: You must not interrupt the speaker. The Noisy One (to one of his neighbours): No, sir, I am not a blackguard don't say so. Order being restored, Mr. Dillwyn continued: The end of it had been that they had what he would call a double-faced measure, for whilst they told the farmers they would give them a good measure, they gave the wink to the landlord, and the landlords said they would be able to contract them- selves out yet." He did not think the Bill was worth the paper it was printed on—it was blighted with the per- missive taint, and it led him to believe that Conservative progress meant permissive legislation. (Hear, hear.) There was another Bill introduced for the benefit of the working classes which might have been much better, but it was cut down from being a good measure to a very worthless one—he referred to the Friendly Societies Bill. He should not go into the whole question everybody recognised that the assets of these societies should be valued, and their liabilities assessed. It had been described in the Daily News as "a permissive measure of a dan- gerous character, lending the apparent sanction of the Government to indiscriminate, unsound, and precarious enterprises." It was a Bill which he thought ought never to have been passed, as it would mislead the people who trusted to the Government sanction. There were many excellent societies in existence, such as the Oddfellows Society, and if other societies had been conducted like the Oddfellows, there would have been no necessity for legis- lation. This Bill would give a quasi sanction to societies not worthy of it. (Hear, hear.) The Bill was destroyed in its progress through the House. There were one or two other Bills, such as the Pollution of Rivers Bill and others, which were set out by the Government at the beginning of the Session, and afterwards abandoned—why, he did not know and others were hurried through the House. The Merchant Shipping Bill was one of the latfer. (Ap- plause.) The latter Bill was introduced with a great parade at the beginning of the Session. It was a Bill, he thought, which embraced too much it embraced two separate" divisions in regard to the Merchant Shipping which had better have been kept separate. One related to contracts between shipowners and sailors, the other related to the sending out of rotten ships, grain cargoes, and the insisting on a load-line. The speaker referred to the legislation affecting contracts between masters and men, and the payment of wages, which, he said, was very cumbrous, and interfered, as some believed, a little too much with master and man. The Merchant Shipping Bill was pushed forward vigorously for some time, and there .were a great many amendments brought forward, but about the middle of the Session, all of a sudden, it was dropped. They heard no more of it; month after month elapsed, and the people asked, where is the Mer- chant Shipping Bill ? No satisfactory answer was given, and the measure was apparently shunted till the very end of the Session. There were urgent demands for it the people were in favour of it, and the country wanted it, but it never would have been passed had it not been for an occurrence towards the end of the Session. The Liberal side would, almost to a man have voted for the Bill, and especially for the part which would prevent the sending out of rotten ships with grain cargoes, &c. That was a part which was pressed for and urgently demanded. At the end of the Session the Bill was again demanded, but it was again shunted to make way for the miserable Agricultural Holdings Bill (applause)—a Bill of great importance to our naval community—to our gallant sailors was shunted to make way for a Bill that neither farmers nor landlords wanted, and that no one wanted. (Applause.) They all remembered the scene that took place when Mr. Plimsoll came forwarded-(cheers)— there was an unanimous, he might say, howl of condem- nation throughout the country at the conduct of the Government in the abandoning the Bill. Mr. Plimsoll got extremely excited and some of them, he amongst others, took part in the promotion of the measure. Those in favour of the Bill were backed by a sufficiently strong fealing of the country, to enable them to get a good measure passed, but the Government becoming frightened, he supposed, or at any rate not dating to resist the feeling of the country, said they would them- selves bring in another Bill. They had not time to pass the Bill before the House, but they would bring in a temporaly measure, and that temporary measure he thought, was a very objectionable one—one that would not be tolerated except as a temporary measure, and why. It gave arbitrary powers to persons in ditferent parts of the country, not to the Government, not to any recog- nized authority, but to irresponsible persons to send forth or to retard vessels as they might think fit. This was very much like what the Turkish Government did. He did object to powers of an arbitrary character being put into the bands of irresponsible persons for any tem- porary purpose. The Bill was so urgent that it passed, and he believed that it was being worked satisfactorily. It was a very bungling Bill, granting very exceptional power to make up for the blunder of the Government. One other measure he must refer to, find that was a measure which he had always foreseen, and foretold with a Conservative Government—a measure taking from them some of those things which they had fought for in the past. He had always believed that they would see some backward steps, and they would not see progress. He thought that Conservative progress meant permissive legislation at the best. In one thing they had again re- traced their steps. The Liberal Government induced the House of Commons to grant a very large sum of money to get rid of purchase in the army—(cheers),—a practice which he believed, and which the country believed, was a blight upon the army, and a blight upon the service. This was got rid of under the late Government; it was only allowed in certain cases, and under very exceptional conditions. Exchange might be made, but in no case might money be passed in excess of what might be the necessary expenses incurred in the removal from one country to another. The Government had now brought in a measure which enabled rich men to go where they liked on paying money to poor men. If a rich man was in India and wanted to come home it enabled him to come home by exchanging with a poor man. This was the first retrograde step. The Bill was carried by a majority of about a hundred, but there were such strong arguments brought against it that Mr. Hardy in the House of Com- mOils, ynd the Duke of Cambridge in the House of Lords, both assured the country that the power should not be used in the way it had been in the past. He supposed that so long as they were in office they would keep their word, but the measure was a practical falling away from the past. The Bill was passed in the teeth of a very strong opposition. As it was a retrogressive measure, so it rallied all the Conservative party but also as it was a retrogressive measure, so it rallied all the Liberal party. These were samples of the measures which had been passed, and they wouldragree with him that they had not been satisfactory by any means. What the cause of that failure might be was another matter the cause of the failure was not Liberal opposition. The Liberals sup- ported every progressive measure, and the party were all united in one thing -they were all for progress; but whether they were for fast or more moderate progress was another question. Some were for going faster than others. The Conservatives were not all united—one sec- tion of them were for going moderately forward, and another for going backward therefore all their measures had been mutilated and destroyed by a system of com- promise. If they looked at the history of those Bills, whether in the Cabinet or in the House, they would find that there had been two parties, some for progress, and others who believed that if in some things they went forward, they ought to have a period of retrogression to compensate for it. He believed that that was the cause of the mutilation of those Bills which he had referred to. The Conservatives did put before them a very good and a very fair programme, and they hoped they would have carried it out, but they had not carried it out. After re- ferring to the Patent Laws Bill, which he objected to as getting rid of that law by a side wind, the matter being of great interest to mechanics, he said there was a pro- posal made to hand over all the patronage in the Church to the bishops. He did not think the bishops the right persons to be entrusted with it. (Cheers.) There had been some returns moved for which were by no means creditable to the bishops. There was a good deal of nepotism. Vast numbers of livings in the patronage of the bishops it was found were handed over to bishops' sons and relatives. (Laughter and applause.) He was not in favour of handing over that vast amount of pat- ronage to the bishops. (Cheers.) He put an amendment against that Bill, and it was not carried. He was the first to do that, and whether any credit or discredit was due to him for it he must ;ake the onus of it. There was a Bill brought in by Mr. Russell Gurney proposing to pay the judge under the Public Worship Regulation Act out of Queen Anne's Bounty, and certain fees for marriages, and so forth, in the hands of the Commis- sioners. He objected to the latter, on the ground that if fees were paid in excess of what were required they ought to be returned to those who paid them, and not made a source of revenue. (Cheers.) These clauses were with- drawn. There was one other Bill he objected to, and that was the Bill to provide bishops all over the country. He objected to it because as they knew he did not believe the Church of England was of long continuance. (Prolonged cheers and hisses.) He saw the Church of England torn by internal disorder; he saw it isolated from without; he saw the Dissenters no better disposed to the Establish- ment as an establishment than they used to be; he saw no difference in the position of the Church, and he could not believe from what was going on in the country that the Church would remain any very long time. (Cheers.) He objected on this ground to the in- crease of bishops also. If there were to be more bishops, let it be done upon authority, on the responsi- bility of the Government, as in the case of the bishopric of St. Alban's. If the episcopate was to be in- creased, it ought not to be by a commission, but by the Government of England. He was afraid their prospects were not very good. He saw there was a disposition in the Government to go backwards. They would see some of the measures obtained by the Liberal majority taken from them he instanced the action of the Government in reference to the naval cadets as an example of the dis- position of the Government to retrograde. The court- martial in reference to the loss of the Vanguard was an example. (Loud cheers.) They had made one man a scapegoat for the rest. (Renewed cheers.) He would have singled out the Admiral if he could, and the Admiral had demanded an enquiry, which he ought to have had. The circular in regard to the slaves (loud cheers), was another instance. Nothing could be more hostile to the feeling of the English nation but, as in the case of the Merchant Shipping Bill, the Government had eaten humble pie. (Laughter.) He was very much afraid that a very determined attempt would be made before long to wrest from the School Boards the education of the country; he saw many movements which led him to that opinion. There would be a very determined movement made to get back the education into Church schools. There were various plans brought forward, which simply meant going back to voluntary schools again, and the same thing would be attempted in regard to endowed schools. When the Liberals were in they were able to give the endowed schools a pretty liberal tendency; but now they were trying to alter that. The hon. gentleman referred to & school at Exeter iu which WigiQUII instruction was to be given, provided such religious instruction should he. in accordance with the doctrine of the Church of Eng- land." (Hisses). That was a matter about which they would hear next year. They heard a great deal about the future in England; they heard that England was going back. He was no croaker, and he did not think so, but he said that in order to prevent the country from goiugback they must progress, and therefore he hoped that they would see again the party of progress in power. (Cheers.) If they were to kesp up with the world, and the world was going on and progressing very fast—depend upon it they must move as well as it; therefore it was he wished the party of progress to be in power. The Liberal party must be in power they must watch well the course of public affairs, they must take care that protection was not restored, whether protection of labour, protection of property, protection of industry, or protection in other forms; they must take care that it was not again allowed to hamper the resources and fetter the trade of the coun- try they must take care that privilege and patronage should not be allowed to reassert their baneful influence in our Civil service (cheers); and they must take care that superstition did not again poison "the healthy tone of public opinion. (Loud and continued cheers). He did not believe that the torpor of Conservative reaction would long remain. There were many great questions which would have to be dealt with,—the question of the repre- sentation of the people, which was far from complete. There were questions of education, which still required to be carried further and developed, and all this was only to be accomplished by the reinstatement of the Liberals in office. (Hear, hear.) He would for himself much rather be on the Opposition than on the Government side. He did not believe that it was to the interest of the country, for it was a progressive county, and would assert its desire to progress before, long, that the Conservatives should be in power. What might be the course of the next Parliament he could not say, but he hoped the Liberals would be in power. Whether he should health and strength to represent Swansea, and whether they would pleased to return him again as their representative, he could not say—(cheers),—but as he got older, and now he was an old man—0"2 years of age—the more convinced and firm he became in his conviction that the truest Con- servatism was Radicalism. (Cheers.) He was fully con- firmed in the Liberal, principles which he had held, and if they should again do him the honour of allowing him to represent them, they might reply upon it that they would always find him in the ranks of progress. (Loud cheers). The Mayor then said it was open for anyone to ask the hon. member questions, and thereupon the individual who had been noisy throughout reasserted himself, and was met with cries of "order." Mr. Lewis, an elector: Mr. Mayor, with every respect due tø you, I have been threatened to be turned ont of the room. (Hear, hear.) I have to ask a few questions as to what Mr. Dillwyn has said, honestly and straight- forwardly, and I have a right to express my feelings in a public meeting. Mayor I must call your attention to the fact that you can only ask questions now. If you have a resolution to propose, or an amendment to put, by-and-by you shall have an opportunity of speaking to it. (Uproar.) A Voice Is he an elector ? Mayor Are you an elector ? You are, I presume. Mr. Lewis I have been here 16 years. Mayor If you wish to put a question, you can do so now. Mr. Lewis: No, sir—("Order")—I want to ask Mr. Dillwyn whether he has modified—(Laughter and inter- ruption.) Mayor: Will you put your question ? Mr. Lewis I want to ask Mr. Dillwyn whether—(Dis- turbance.) Mayor Put it. Mr. Lewis: You ask me to put a question to Mr. Dillwyn. (Laughter and commotion.) I am sure it would not be a right thing in this assembly to stop me. Mr. Mayor, you ask me to put a question—(Loud laughter.) Mayor Order, gentlemen. I took exception to his conduct just now, but I really feel you are now imitating bis example. I wish you would give him an opportunity of putting his question. Mr. Lewis: I am obliged to you, Mr. Mayor. (Laughter and hisses.) I want to ask Mr. Dillwyn -(Laughter, and Order," Chair.") A Voice: Put your question. (Laughter.) Mr. Lewis I want to ask—(Laughter and uproar.) Mayor I am sorry I cannot secure you a hearing, but I cm only say you are receiving what you deserve. Now, gentlemen, if any one has anything to propose, you have an opportunity of speaking. Alderman Phillips: Having heard the honourable member's speech, I have pleasure in proposing the follow- ing resolution-- Kev. D. Williams Before that resolution is put I want to ask a question. A Voice And I want to ask one. (" Order," "Chair.") Rev. B. Williams: I am sorry I was not here in time to hear the whole address it is quite possible that he has touched upon it. Is the hon. member prepared to support or oppose a in Bill the next Session of Parliament to devote a portion of the school rate towards the support of voluntary schools not under the School Boards? Mr. Dillwyn I had spoken before upon that. I am decidedly opposed to it, and shall oppose it most strongly. (Hear, hear.) An Elector I think everyone has got a little hobey (hobby) and I think I have my little hobey to-night, namely, the Sunday closiag of public houses. (Cheers and hisses.) I think our speaker, the honourable member —I think myself we must legislate in this way before we shall have progress. I shou'.d like to ask when a Bill will come—if he be alive and well—if a Bill comes before Parliament, will he support it—the Sunday-closing Bill ? (Cheers and hisses.) Mr. Dillwyn After having given the question very anxious consideration, I have not been able to bring my- self to see that I can support it. (Cheers and hisses.) The same Elector I have another question—another "hobey "—now. I hope you will excuse me, fellow rate- payers. ("Order, "No, no," "Shut up.") We should like as ratepayers the power to have the chance to speak our minds. ("Be quiet," "Sit down.") I will ask a question. I am going to put it. Will he support the Permissive Bill? ("Sit down," "Question, question. ") I should like to ask my honourable servant—(Loud laughter aud commotion.) Voice: Ask the question. The Elector Certainly, sir. I should like to know if Mr. Dilhvyn, if he takes his seat in St. Stephen's, would he support the Bill to give two-thirds of the people power to say whether there shall be public houses or no? Mr. Dillwyn: I quite accept the position; but I am sorry that I must be a disobedient servant in this respect. I cannot vote for the Permissive Bill. Alderman Phillips: I now have much pleasure in moving the following resolution :—" Having heard the honourable member's address, this meeting desires to ex- press their unabated confidence in him as their repre- sentative." The resolution is simple, but I think it ex- presses all we need express on the present occasion. I hope the honourable member will live long to represent the borough of Swansea and its contributories in the House of Commons. (Hear.) I am sorry to hear him say he is 62 years of age, because we were born in the same year—(laughter)—and I had felt some pleasure in looking at his youthfulness. Consequently I hope to see him represent us for many years to come. The Mayor Is there anyone here who will second it ? Alderman P. Rogers Believing as I do, that Mr. Dillwyn is one of the most honest members of the House of Commons, I have much pleasure in sooonding the reso- lution. (Hear.) The Mayor: Is there any gentleman desirous of sup- porting it. Mr. John Lewis I want to ask a. question affecting the University College of Wales. I should like to have the hOD. member's opinion on it. The M tyor We will not hinder the progress of this re- solution, Mr. Lewis. Afterwards perhaps the hon. gentle- man will answer it out of courtesy. The Mayor then put the resolution, and there was an overwhelming show of hands, and loud cheering. Th3 Mayor Those whd are of the contrary opinion One hand was put up but quickly lowered, amid much laughter. The Mayor There is a solitary dissentient; I declare it carried. Mr. Dillwyn then briefly thanked the meeting for its vote of renewed confidence in him. As to what Mr. Lewis had asked, he did not know how the question would come before him. Mr. Lewis There has been a petition laid before the the Government. Mr. Dillwyn: No, before Parliament. I can t say I am prepared because I don't know what has taken place. Per- haps the matter could be best dealt with in a conversation, and I shall be glad to meet Mr. Lewis. And now, gentle- men, having^addressed you, I am in a position to propose a resolution, which will, I am sure, cordially as you have received the one proposed, will not be less cordially but more heartily received than the other. I propose the health of my excellent friend the present Mayor. (Cheers and laughter.) He has done his work well during the trying year of his Mayoralty, and I propose his health. I beg to move that the thanks of this meeting be given to the Mayor for his kindness in presiding upon this occasion, and I call now for a seconder, Mr. E. M. Richards then rose and said, he had great pleasure in seconding the proposition of the hon. member; it did not want a speech he was sure to commend itself to them. But he hoped he should not be considered out of the way, if he took the opportunity, in seconding this proposition to make a remark or two on a question brought forward by the hon. member.that night. And he felt that he should not be doing justice to himself nor acting man- fully to the right hon. member with whom he had been intimately associated for two or three years, if he did not allude to an entirely unsupported charge which it had been too much the fashion during the last six months to attach to Sir Stafford Northcote. He was sure the hon. member did not intend to do so for a moment. Mr. Dillwyn Hear, hear. Mr. Richards The accusation was first expressed in a newspaper, but many people came to the conclusion that an opinion was correct or incorrect according to the peculiar views they have in politics. Now he was not going to defend Sir Stafford Northcote indeed his mea. sures were far from what they ought to be but he thought undue blame had been heaped upon him in connection with the subject of Friendly Societies. It was very well- known to most of those in the room that this was a sub- ject which he (the speaker) had taken an opportunity of bringing before the House of Commons (cheers), and on a motion made by him, a Royal Commission was issued to inquire into these societies. Sir Stafford Northcote and one or two other honourable members of the present ministry were on the commission, and they inquired into the matter fully, and just before the last vocation the matter was dealt with by Parliament. Now the Daily News of September and other papers at that time seemed to think, or they rather expressed it, that no good had been done by the legislation of the past Session in regard to these societies. Now he entirely differed er.d dissented from that view. (Hear, hear) He believed great good had been done by the Bill which had become an Act, and which was now one of :the Stages of the realm, He lamented as deeply as anyone that Sir Stafford Northcote could not carry the whole of the provisions through Parliament, and having been for some time associated with hiin, he (the speaker) thought he should be wanting in courtesy if he did not say a word or two on the subject. It was rather late, but he thuught the subject merited it. (" Go on.") The hon. member had told them that all the Government had given them was permissive legislation. Now to a great extent it was permissive legislation; but there were stringent regulations laid down in the Act, and although Sir Stafford Northcote had to leave out that portion referring to Government auditors, the speaker thought there was a great deal to be said for the course Sir Stafford adopted. It might be that Government auditors had more opportunity, upon a great many points brought before them,of inquiry, but those who knew any- thing of the workings of these societies knew perfectly well that their progress had been due, not to Government, but to those who had done their duty. The men had filled the offices themselves. (Cheers.) Why, the Man- chester Unity of Oddfellows had had the courage to stand up and tell their own members that they could not rely upon their tables, and the result of their after action was that their society'now stood in the foremost ranks of friendly societies, and he believed it was one of the most perfect organisation, this country leould point to. He accepted the Permissive legislation in regard to Friendly Societies as another proof that Englishmen continue to embrace opportunities, and to show that they are worthy of being trusted. He was sorry to have intruded this question, but an adverse opinion had been expressed generally without thorough ventilation. He seconded the proposition cordially. Mr. Dillwyn disclaimed that he had made any attack upon Sir Stafford Northcote. All he had said was that the amendments which had altered the Bill had been forced upon him. As to the Manchester Unity of Odd- fellows, he (Mr. Dillwyn) was a member of it, and he knew it to be an exceedingly well-managed society. The vote of thanks to the Mayor was then put and car- ried with acclamation. The Mayor briefly thanked the meeting, and the pro- ceedings terminated before ten o'clock.